New Vaccine?

I was at the Vets again yesterday and the receptionist asked me if I also wanted the Porphyromonas (Dental) vaccine. I have never heard of such a thing so I said I'd wait on it until I was able to do some research. She was able to tell me it is for 3 different types of bacteria that cause periodontal desease. Since I don't regularly brush my dog's teeth, I was wondering what the thoughts about this were.

Maybe we could have a separate "health" category for health concerns.

Ann,

I can only speak for our practice and the surrounding area, but it is not been found to be highly accepted. I will look into it a little more, as I have forgotten why we decided against it.

Very Interesting Ann! It is for periodontitis. But, it is being promoted as a "total" part of dental care. Found a link, it is made by Pfizer. Seems to be in clinical trails/studies for its long term effectiveness, as it has been only granted a conditional license. Here is more info on licensing the product: The United States Department of Agriculture (USDA) has granted a conditional license to Pfizer for this product, meaning that the product has met the requirements for purity, safety and a reasonable expectation of efficacy. Long-term efficacy studies are currently in progress

http://www.pfizerah.com/product_overview.asp?drug=PH&country=US&lang=EN&species=CN



Barb and Rock

Periodontitis is caused by 3 main types of bacteria. These bacteria are found in small amounts in healthy mouths, but increase in a diseased state.

Perio disease is similar in humans and dogs. The same bacteria affect both species.

In humans, there have been no approved vaccines for dental disease. There is lots of research being done, but none have been approved. There are few results showing that vaccines have been able to statistically reduce the amount of bacteria.

Again, in humans, perio disease has not been shown to be infectious. The bacteria that cause caries (cavities) is infectious and can be transferred from one person to another. An example: a mother has many carious lesions in her mouth, licks a pacifier that her child drops, and inserts it in the child's mouth. That child is at higher risk for forming caries because of the transfer of bacter from mother to child.

Right now, more research is being done in this area than in periodontal disease. We recommend different eating habits (consuming sugary/sticky/carbs in one sitting rather than nibbling/sippling throughout the day), brushing, flossing, regular checkups to prevent perio disease and caries.

I have been told that this is the same in dogs, as well. Keep an eye on plaque (hard deposits on teeth), give dogs crunchy treats/bones to chew on, get into a habit of teeth brushing.

I didn't start brushing Mocha's teeth when she was a puppy like I did with Kona. With her, I started out by letting her taste the toothpaste. Then I started introducing it to her mouth. It is recommended to brush a dog's teeth everyday, but I admit that I don't. I do the brushing on Sunday's, mainly for lack of time. During the week, the girls have sterilized bones, Nylabones, and Kongs to chew on.

There might actually be a topic that I have more info on than labpaw? I better take advantage of it while I can!

Just kidding, Alisa.

I just did a search on VIN, a veterinary information network site. I read many discussions amongst the boarded dental veterinarians. Some are big proponents of it (giving it to nearly every patient they see), some feel it is a vaccine that shouldn't be on the market yet. Many veterinarians are reporting vaccine reactions (pain at the injection site, fever, severe lameness,etc).

As a veterinarian, I always hesitate to listen to studies that are published by a company promoting their own products, unfortunately. I like to hear what they have to say, though, so I am glad that Barb provided the link. It isn't because these companies aren't being "truthful", it is because they aren't showing both sides (kinda like politicians... they are only going to show the good side, so to speak). For every product, I could point to one of the company's studies that show how good it is, and then to a competitor's study that shows how awful it is. It is, to say the least, very confusing to everyone. It seems like that shouldn't be able to happen, but miraculously, everybody has a study to disprove someone else's study.... so I usually look for the studies that are independent of the maker of the product. Those studies are more likely to be unbiased and have less vested interest in the outcome, except good science. Hopefully....

I am way too picky about what I give my dogs to give a vaccine that I am not 100% comfortable with. Reason being that once you inject it, there is no getting it back. It is a relatively new vaccine, and until I know more about it and there are more independent research studies, I am not going to give it to my dogs just yet (remember, it is just my opinion and I am not saying that anyone else should or shouldn't give it to their own).

Not to say that they couldn't use a little improvement with their doggie breath, however!

CoffeeDogs wrote:
There might actually be a topic that I have more info on than labpaw? I better take advantage of it while I can!

Just kidding, Alisa.

Laura... there are SO many things I could learn from you and your expertise! You are FAR more qualified about MANY, MANY things than I!

Thanks for all of the great info everyone. I am not good at brushing my boys teeth even though I know that I should be doing it. It is a struggle as we all know. Does it get easier? If I am consistent for a month or so will it be nothing for me?

It does get easier with time. Main thing is to start out by taking it slow and only doing short sessions on part of their mouth at a time. Usually, we recommend just starting out by letting the dog lick the toothpaste off the brush. Eventually, bit by bit, you can build up to longer sessions and cover more of their teeth at a time. Just make sure ot use a canine toothpaste only, as human ones contain floride, which shouldn't be swallowed.

It does take some getting used to, but with a good deal of patience and consistency, it does get easier and the dogs become more accepting, or at least tolerant, of it. And, just like near any learned behavior, the earlier in the dog's life you start, the better.

Yeah, but look at it this way, if your dog has known periodontal disease, this product could be a godsend. Periodontitis can lead to tooth loss and if the infection enters the bloodstream, it can potentially infect the heart, liver and kidneys.

This is not pretty,



More Info:

According to the American Veterinary Dental Society, 80 percent of dogs have signs of oral disease by age three. Signs your pet may have dental problems is often indicated by bad breath, a change in eating or chewing habits, and pawing at the face and mouth.

Proper dental care is sooo important for our animals. I too, am guilty on the amount of brushing my dogs are now receiving. They both do receive their yearly dental scaling, with an occasional "skip" because they are looking so good


Barb and Rock

What is it called where they knock them out to clean the teeth? I have that done for Jake once a year.

Dental Scaling Matt... I was editing as you posted.


Barb and Rock

We do basically the same things for your dog/cat that we get when we go to our dentists. We call it a dental prophy (which is scaling, cleaning, polishing, etc). And, dental health month is February, so check with your vets to see if they have any promotions, etc for clients. We give discounts for dental prophys!

Thanks Barb. I will do that for Gunther too but I haven't had him that long yet.

Thanks Alisa...I will be sure to check with our vet for any February discount. I need to get Jake's done before his insurance renewal in April because the dental cleaning benefit changes on me.

Thanks Alisa, Laura, Barb & Kel for your input! I too need to be more aggressive in brushing my dog's teeth so I don't have to make these decisions!!!

No, Thank YOU Ann for posting this information. This is what makes a forum valuable. Although, I didn't want to mention it before. BUT, I found it a bit odd that your Receptionist offered this to you.... does she receive a commission??


Barb and Rock